Does so-called Affirmative Action in South Africa discriminate against whites?

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tay_jen1

yes.

pixie_1211

Can we perhaps get you suspended for creating multiple accounts? BRAD MORRIS?

dWali

Affirmative Action in any form is discriminatory. This discrimination is worst against white males. There is however NO LAW that says one may not discriminate. It is only illegal to discriminate unfairly.

The ILO (Inetrnational Labour Organisation) has given its blessing to the way AA is being implemented in Sa, and feels that it should even be speeded up.

I dislike AA, but do not know of a better quick fix for inequities created in the past.

Anria A

Affirmative action is a knee jerk reaction after apartheid, and it did discriminate for the first few years after the idea was started, but soon so many inexperienced people where employed, simply because of the color of their skin, that many work places where left with slow work forces and employees sitting around not knowing what to do.
People have started to learn from that mistake, and are employing more and more people on merit, not on race.
But also, in the last 10years a whole new generation of proper university (and not bush college) educated black people have emerged as well, so many who are employed are qualified for the job.
Likewise, many white South Africans had no tertiary education, because in apartheid you got a job simply for being white, and now they struggle to understand why they have trouble finding work.
I use my parents as an example. My mother only ever finished High school, during apartheid there where many office and PA jobs available, but these days an employer would rather have someone who's been to college, and she struggles to find work.
My father does have a tertiary education, and even in the height of affirmative action, changed jobs, and had no trouble finding another job.
Affirmative action is slowly starting to fizzle out, and more and more people are being employed based on experience.

Me :-)

I don't exactly agree with Anria A, she makes it sound like its on the way to the better. It is not true that more people are getting chosen on merit....and what do you mean that the white people in the past did not have high qualifications if those exact people are leaving SA for better international jobs.....Apartheid was a really bad era and it should not be repeated nor should it be switched and if Afirmative Action carries on it will be like the Aparheid but this time the white people will be on the wrong end...
They should make everyone equal and ONLY choose on qualifications, there are many white people, black people, indian people etc with high qualifications and those should be the ones with the jobs, and affirmative action should be overlooked. The education in SA is getting lower and lower and the passing marks are decreasing.
In 1994, the people wanted freedom and equality.....so why can't we stick with that.....
and also, the generation of white people who are now studying had nothing to do with apartheid, because they were too young to even understand it, so, yes, apartheid was bad and the people that started weren't to good either....but people must stop looking at the white people of SA and judge them.

Take care
:-)
Me

andy

yes because whites with the right qualifications will have a less chance of getting a job, which is really unfair for people who have spent their time studying and have a 25% chance only because of their colour(and i am not white i am a coloured)

Vango

Yes, the assholes of the past practised apartheid, the assholes of the present practise affirmative action and other forms of bad government. No wonder more than one million, mostly highly qualified people, left SA over the last 10 years. I love my country and wish I could go back every minute of every day, were it not for our racist and weak government. Greetings from the Orient.

robsnor

Yes it does. I agree that it was the other way around during "apartheid" but must our kids and all future generations be punished for mistakes of the past.

gem

why does it concern u?! do u even live here?

Joyce F

Anria is correct. It is fizzling out and will with time.

However, please note that it is necessary to have this in place to rectify over 40 years of white male preferance in the work-place - you automatically had a job if you were white and male irrespective of intelligence or training or education, while non-whites could not even get a job even if they were qualified for it. Affirmative Action is not unique to SA, it is practiced internationally also in the USA - just called minority preference here. And for interest: this is how affirmative action works in SA:
If all these applicants have the same qualifications and experience, the job will go as follows to the person:
1. black female
2. white female (women were discriminated against as well in Apartheid and now qualifies, irrespective of race for affirmative action)
3. black male
4. white male

Why white people in SA are so up and arms about this is just mindboggling - they did it to the majority (and black children who are now adults - and who were once an innocent new generation as well) for so many years, what makes them so special now? What you sow you shall reap, and so will your children.

ByHisGrace

I am a 25 yr old white South African female. I grew up in the so called new South Africa. I love my country. I do feel a bit discriminated against because I am being punished for what white people did in the past. I have been turned down for a job before because I am white. I am happy about apartheid being over and all having equal opportunities but it is to some extent unfair on us who are not guilty of apartheid.

FridayNighter

Sadly so...they blame us for Apartheid, but they're doing the exact same thing...just with a different name!!

Den P

yes but the theory is that it gives redress to past inequities

Nut B

yes it does

cheryl l

Yes it does. This is a straight forward answer.

mr_zot

to be honest,its got nothing to do with revenge or racisisim. its all about money.just like apartied was. the boers who were a small group of people who came over from overseas were trying to look for a new life in south africa,one where they could be rich.and in order to do that they had to rule out competition (apartied), its the same with affirmitive action. its all about money and the evel ways in wich people will do things to get it.
to be honest thou i agree with your statement thou, mr as a south african i fell it is unfair on white people. its been 10 years already.

Yes it does.

moya

It sure discriminates against me and I was born in the 80's , so what I had to do with apartheid remains a mystery to me. Also, I think a boundary should put in place so that blacks who have completed their schooling from Gr 1 to Gr 12 in the last 12 years can't moan that they were not given the same opportunities as whites. Sometimes I wonder what parallel universe some South Africans wonder on (I'm referring to a certain statement that Affirmative action is slowly being moved out- it isn't).
My ten cents.

â™¥haggisbasherâ™¥

Well if it does it's their own fault, they have discriminated against blacks long enough.

Alf Garnett

Sorry Anria A but that is propaganda you are spewing and far from the truth. There are 2 issues governing so called Affirmative Action. The Employment Equity Act and BEE. The 1st seeks to change the demographics of the workplace to reflect those of the Country and the 2nd to transfer ownership of business into Black hands. The Act seeks through a clause termed " Previously Disadvantaged" to define people by race and those not included in the definition are white males who are said to have been advantaged. Subsequently any white male over the age of approx. 30 has 2 chances of getting a job in the Corporate sector unless they have skills that are not available. The Act asks employers to set ever increasing targets at all levels throughout the workplace and employers are required to report annually or receive a substantial fine. Consequently Black people who form the greatest population numbers are being recruited and promoted at levels way beyond most of their competency. To make room for them White males in particular are being retrenched or have their service terminated but other races and genders are also feeling the pressure. Unfortunately in South Africa much business is done with the Government or quasi government and so Companies who wish to get business have to show good progress with Employment Equity or they are not even considered for contracts. This takes the form of submitting workplace statistics and other affirmative actions such as sponsoring anything that can be regarded as solely Black or showing that they traded only with Black owned or partly Black owned Companies ( this is known as a procurement policy).
The net result of this is twofold:
A distinct drop in standards and quality
A growing unemployment rate of Whites but Males in particular.
Interestingly when the Dept of Labour reports on the unemployment rate it will say publicly that the rate is 26% but when pressed they will admit to a further 14% whom they classify as not seeking employment. You can safely assume this 14% is Whites ( mostly Males) who have given up the ghost after having been refused a position so often on the grounds of race. So the real unemployment rate is 40% and if you believe it is easy for a White person to get a job I would ask you to check the Sunday Times job adverts which state in every instance almost without fail that " the Company seeks to employ candidates in line with it's Employment Equity Policy " i.e. Whites need not apply.
In an effort to comply with the Act most Companies sought to replace "soft target" positions with Black people so consequently areas like Human Resourcing are almost Black dominated. Furthermore a number of previously White owned Recruitment Companies have gone out of business because the new Human Resources faces refuse to deal with them unless, often, if a bribe is offered i.e a % of the recruitment fee is paid to the HR person. A good friend of mind who was a Head Hunter at the high end of the market went out of business for precisely this reason because he refused to compromise his morals. I am also aware of many others who have experienced the same dilemma.Look also at recently released Government statistics showing that a whole generation of White South Africans ( nearly a million ) have left the Country in the last 10 years citing citing lack of employment prospects and crime as the main reasons. And it is not only White people for I have met many,many South Africans of all colours in the South East of England who are saying exactly the same. They all miss the weather but I have yet to speak to one who is considering going back on a permanent basis unless there is radical change for the better. In every corner of the Globe there are numerous South Africans working and living like has never been known before and they did not leave for any reason other than crime and lack of employment opportunities.
Whilst one can appreciate and support any move to give Black people more opportunity in the workplace to do so at the expense of showing your prime skills base the front door is suicide in the medium to long term. Already this can be seen in the Health and Education fields where service is rocketing backwards. South African education qualifications of today are almost not worth the paper they are written on and are generally not recognised or accepted overseas. Have a good hard look at class sizes and Teacher expertise as well as the lowering of standards and you will understand why.
The present policy of affirmative action in South Africa is particularly badly thought through as prime skills are being driven out of the Country and any White youngster about to leave school will find out very shortly that their job prospects are not very good. Hence the reason why the UK,Australia,New Zealand,the US and Canada have a high number of South African immigrants ( more than 600,000 in the UK alone.) The economic outlook for South Africa is bleak through this Act and do not be fooled by claims that the economy is growing. That is purely on the back of consumer credit spending and foreign investor speculation but there are no new factories etc being built so the big bang is going to come. I predict that after 2010 South Africa will rapidly descend into a typical African economy and there will be a further mass exodus of citizens.

rabbit

Yes, because it means that a white person, very often one who had nothing to do with apartheid, gets a raw deal. Also the best candidate for the job is not always chosen.

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