Palistine And Isreal conflict; who was there first??

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Psycho

I wonder how those people think, being pro-Israel is non sense..

Guys, so you're basically saying that israelies were there first, and that no Arab identity existed ?..how lame is that ?
stop kidding yourself, plz..
How do you want me to believe, that amongst ALL these ARAB nations, in the MIDDLE of the ARAB world, just above ARABIA; the ORIGIN of ARABS, existed a NON-ARAB nation ?...this goes against LOGIC..

Assume what you say is right, where did this FOREIGN nation come from ?...did they grow from beneath the ground ?...it's like trying to convince me that the state of Texas is French of Buddhism origin...does that make sense to any sane person?

I don't care for all the Propaganda made by you, I don't buy all your lies, yet I pity the poor world for the False information stuffed into their heads...

What soothes me is that I'm pretty sure Palestine is gonna get back to us, Muslims..insha'Allah

Baltek

The Canaanites were there first.
(And I'm sure someone was there even before them!)

Basically, I'm on the side of peace, but I would like to see the Palestinians have their own state.

fatma

hey beautiful

i dont think it is right to take sides... with ppl taking sides everything becomes worse !! and more problems evolve!!!

i dont know what goes on with the sirealis but the muslims i do .. therefore i cannot comment!!

i hope all this fighting and war stops and everyone gets what is theirs....

peace all around

Emrldz

The Palistinians and the Israelites come from the same race of people hundreds of years ago.

Fanano

I won't take a side, I'll just describe, demonstrate, and make you feel what people in the 21st modern century are going throught..
________

There were Jews in the Arab World, but ARAB JEWS...
ARAB JEWS that lived in the country/empire "Palestine/Trans-Jordan/Philistine/ÙÙ„Ø³Ø·ÙŠ...

The Arab Empire used to be a huge nation more like the Soviet Union, but when France & Great Britain conquered the Arabian countries they broke them apart causing them to become separate countries, but still we have the same language (Arabic), and the majority is Muslims, then comes Christians, lastly, Jews. Jews did exist in the Arab World. Yes, I do not disagree with that. Morocco, Yemen, Bahrain & other Arab countries have Jews, but they did not go ahead and make their own country because they said so! They leave peacefully with the Arab Muslims & Christians.

>> It's like IMAGINE the Jews of the USA, go Ahead and claim New York to be their new "Jewish State of New York" .. what would you do? Will you agree on giving them half of the state just because the UN & the Jews agree on it. No, you won't, you will either tell them to stop this non-sense or go and get your land back yourself.

God! Be logical ! It even doesn't make sense that a whole new country with different language exists in between Arab nations. At least, our neighbors like Iran & Turkey have similar political, religious, and language ties. They are similar to us and that makes sense because that's how things were!!

The present Israelis are not the Arab Jews, they are mix of Russian & other Eastern European countries...

I don't need to prove anything, but if you go through historical books "not Arab ones or Israeli ones" through normal historical books you can find out yourself.

I am not benefiting anything, I just worry on the Mosques & Churches & Synagogues that are being ruined by the Israelis...

"Stereotyped-beings say that Arabs are greedy over one land when they have 22 countries." First of all, Palestine is an Arab country, but it is it's own country it has to deal with itself. Would you accept France to take over England & say well you have so much land: Scotland, Ireland, Wales. I assure you 100% you will not agree because humans in nature would not agree that a millimeter of their property is taken away illegally without even questioning. Why are Jews so greedy? They are the ones that expand there land by the day, weren't they smaller, and then took over Sinai, then Golan Heights & Southern Lebanon... God, this is too obvious: don't blame the poor Israelis. Blame the Government for it's reckless & greedy actions!

For crying out loud, they turned many ancient mosques to bar... How would you feel if your church was taken away from you and sold to the government; hence, turned into some kind of bar or restaurant.

Tuti, may God help you & repay for your loss. "What goes around, comes around". God will avenge your loss with something greater in Heaven.

In my opinion, if Israel stops making this non-sense & agrees to live peacefully in Palestine or does whatever it wants the Middle East would be as peaceful as the forest.

World Peace

Regards,
Fanano

Aussie

The venom & passion on both sides of this argument shows how this issue will eat away at these current generations & all to follow unless somebody backs away from this stupid argument of who is right & who is wrong !

That is not the real issue here & neither is the argument that possession is nine tenths of the law ! What needs to happen & it could just as easily start with this forum , is that people with respect for other people as human beings stop throwing stones at each other & approach this problem with goodwill instead of hatred !

Neither side has a mortgage on the truth ! Neither side has a mortgage on justice ! From Israel all we ever hear is that this land was promised to them & from the Palestinians that it was taken from them ! Surely in this modern era there is room for compromise from both sides...if there isn't , this misery & mayhem will continue generation after generation without solution , Why ...because grown adults won't reach out to each other & forgive, but rather use the hatred to gain political advantage over their opponents ! This applies to both sides & is equally disgusting !

elias

ehem, palestinians come from philistines, hence palestine, philistines are as ancient as the greeks and lived during the same time as the canaanites, so technically the palestinians were there first and if the jews were there first why would they need to create a country that should have been exsistent before palestine?

Cherrylou

This is more of a request: I'd like to read a Christian perspective concerning Israel and the Occupied Territories.

David V

Depends on how far back you go.

The main city everyone is fighting over is Jerusalem, it being the capital of the area and the host of holy sites for three different religions.

There are many different beliefs as to when Jerusalem was founded and by whom. According to tradition the city was founded by Shem and Eber, ancestors of Abraham. Around 1000 BCE, the Jewish king Solomon built the Temple on what is known as the Temple Mount to house the Ark of the Covenant.
About 930 BCE, the 10 northern tribes split off and became the Kingdom of Israel, and the southern tribes were the Kingdom of Judah with Jerusalem as it's capital.

The Assyrians conquered the Kingdom of Israel in 722 BCE
Around 586 BCE, the Babylonians conquered Judah and Jerusalem, and laid waste to Solomon's Temple.

In 538 BCE, Persian King Cyrus the Great permitted the Jews to return to Judah to rebuild Jerusalem and their holy temple. Construction of the Second Temple, was completed in 516 BCE.

After this came a period of shifting control and the area ended up under Roman rule, during which the Jews were banned from Jerusalem, starting around 400 CE

In 638, the Arabs conquered the area.

See. It really matters how far back you go.

allergic_to_morning

Both Palestinians and Jews have claims on this land. Can you read the following with an open mind, given that you state you are categorically on the side of the Palestinians? Personally I don't think it's a case of 'sides' - I believe that both Jews and Palestinians desperately need a peaceful solution.

Some key points that you must consider if you want to make a fair assessment of the situation are:

It's historical fact that until 1967 - some two decades AFTER Israel was established, there was no such thing as the 'Palestinian people' as we know them today. They were referred to by others, and indeed called themselves, simply 'Arabs'.

Jews have lived in Palestine for over three thousand years. Jerusalem is mentioned countless times in Jewish lore; it is not mentioned in the Koran and when Muslims pray, they face Mecca, not Jerusalem.

Jews and Muslims can - and did! - live in peace together. Prior to 1948, when Israel was created, both religions lived in Palestine and there were few problems. The trouble started when the Arab countries rejected the partition plan. In other words, and this is CRUCIAL: the Jews agreed swiftly to the land being split equally between themselves and the Arabs living there. But the surrounding Arab nations were totally opposed.

68 per cent of Muslims who fled what was to become Israel, did so without ever even seeing a Jewish person. They were NOT driven out! They were summoned out by their fellow Arabs in the neighbouring countries - so that those same countries could then attack the newly born state of Israel and purge the area of Jews. And this is precisely what happened - except the Arab armies were very poorly organised and Israel managed to hold her own.

The areas of land that Israel has now, that she didn't have in 1948, she acquired ONLY during wars that were initiated by her Arab neighbours.

The Muslim countries have done nothing for the Palestinians, other than to arm them. Israel has provided brand new hospitals, housing, and universities, and she provides free water and electricity. Can you imagine any other people doing this for those that want to destroy them? But the Israelis do.

All Israel wants is for the Palestinians to recognize her basic right to exist. What other nation on earth has to ask for this??? None!!!

All Israel asks is that the Palestinians reject terrorism. What did the Palestinians do? Elect Hamas - a group that carries out numerous suicide attacks in Israel and targets civilians.

So now things are that much harder. It's tragic. If you kill a Palestinian or a Jew, their blood looks the same. It's all just so very, very sad.

ABANDONED

We were there first!
I dont give a rat's behind if you had temples there millions of years ago.
How would you AMericans like it if suddenly the Native Americans decided to fight back against you??
And tell me, if somebody were to break into your home armed and loaded killing your family what would you do? Follow orders and leave or fight back?? What we do is common sense and self defense yet these spineless fools call us terrorists for it!!
For every one armed Israeli soldier gets killed, 20 innocent civilians get killed yet WE ARE THE TERRORISTS?? I had cousins burned alive and shot to death, an aunt who's house was destroyed, every male family member imprisoned, and my grandfather was having a stroke and needed to get to a hospital he was in an ambulance and they wouldnt let him cross the checkpoint. I go there in the summer and get held at gun point, THEY POINT A DAMN GUN AT MY HEAD AS IF I AM A THREAT TO THEIR SECURITY FOREVER AND YELL AT ME IN HEBREW AS IF I UNDERSTAND WHATTHE HELL THEY ARE SAYING!! imagine, i am an American citizen and a teenage girl half their size and all because i hold a palestinian citizenship too they treat me like live ammunition.
ISRAEL is the terrorist they dont want peace they want us all dead! barbarians, thieves, murderers.
This is my opinion thumb me down whatever keep being scared of the truth and hiding from it.
and u know what i dont care what they do no matter what i am always going back everyyear....

"And if I am killed, it will be in Falasteen.
It's written on my every breath.
So in your own patriotic words,
Give me liberty or give me death."

Bil roo7, Bil Dam, Nifdiki ya Falasteen!!

wolf

Palestine. Israel only came into existence 40 years ago after the Arab Israeli war. And the Zionists stole more land then they were granted. And the USA refuses to recogonize Palestine yet they are happy with supporting a false nation like Israel. http://www.palestineremembered.com
http://www.counterpunch.org
I'm Muslim by the way and support Palestine, refuse to recongize Israel and may Prophet Isa(PBUH*) come back to help the Muslims get Palestine back.

Kane #1 Fan

Hard to say: The Romans gave the name Palestine which was known as the Land of Canaan back then.... We call it Israel.... and that is the name.

E A C

The Palestinians and also what ever current local people there are locals who are the closest descendants of the ancient Israelites, both in Jesus' time and probably even in Moses time. Those who know their Torah and Bible probably know on who are the Israelites, they are Middle Eastern people.

There's no known record of the whole area was evacuated completely in the past, as matter in fact the whole Israelite civilization pretty much flourished during 7th century and after on.

Now as for the recently settled 'Jews' of Israel, they are from outside Israel, who mostly came from Europe, who might be distant cousins of descendants of the ancient Israelites.

But their claim as the descendants of the ancient Israelites are only as valid as the claim of most of the rest of the world are descendants of the ancient Israellites, since most of the rest of the world are descendants of the ancient Israellites in one way or another.

Personally, this 'who is there first' argument is just arguing over who is there first is just arguing on who immigrate there first, since all humans are immigrants in one way or another.

There's NO indigenous tribe in this world, "indigenous" just as term use by 'specific interest' groups to oppose the current local official government.

And also personally, I don't think the actual Palestinians really wanted a separate government from the current Israel government, they are actually probably pretty much willing to obey the local government, who ever the government is.

The so called PLO movement are just like the CNRT from East Timor/Timor Leste and also the IRA from Ireland, they are separatists movements supported by an outside party, who claimed to represent the voice of the local people.

And they probably somehow connected to the Pharises/separatists in Jesus' time.

inat

Jews have maintained a presence in Israel for the last 4,000 years. Palestinians are really Jordanians.Educate yourself (and use the spell check button):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians

The angels have the Arc Light.

You do realize of course that there was NO Palestinian people until 1917. The Ottoman Empire had controlled the entire region for 500 years and the Arabs living in the particular area were just sort-of Pan-Arabic.

So yeah, the Hebrews were there first. Arab identity didn't develop until a couple of thousand years later.

And you do realize of course when the UN proposed a partition of the territory so that half would become Israel, the other half was to be Arab. And that it was Arab leaders of other countries who rejected it.

That's all fact. The Palestinian Arabs could have had their own country peacefully in 1947, just like the Palestinian Jews had theirs, albeit with less than 12 hours peace.

Look at the map on the link below. There are 22 Arab and Muslim countries. Why is that small sliver of land too much to ask for?

Yo Yo Yo

I am with Palestine, cuz Tuty is Palestinian.

mark

Its a myth to most people who was there first. But let us to gather recall the people who lived in the Holy land and what part of the holy land they inhabited. The Canaanite people were the first people to live all over the Holy land. Then came the old Palestinians who lived on the Western part of the Holy land. Then came the old Jews who lived in the eastern part of the holy land where both old Jewish kingdoms existed for only 80 years.
racists Zionists claim that the Ancient Jews who lived in the Holy Land 3000 years go were their ancestors while they deny the contemporary Palestinian people the right to claim their antecessors the Ancient Palestinian People
Palestine was the name of the Holy Land from the Roman time up to now Palestine is 2007 years old.
After world war one the country was called Palestine and it had a government called the Mandate government of Palestine not Israel . A historical fact no one can deny. Most of the world states did not exist when Palestine existed

Michael J

I don't think it's a matter of "sides".
The Jewish answer is that both Jewish sources as well as secular ones prove unequivocally that Jews ruled the land of Israel for over 1,000 years, and maintained a popular majority there for practically that entire time span. That came to an end in the first and second century, and the Jews summarily spread out in the world with a dream to someday return. Recently they have, and their claim predates any Palestinian claim.
The Palestinian perspective (or at least what I've understood of it from this board) is that modern day Palestinians are descended from the biblically mentioned Philistines, who were contemporary with Jewish control of the land and thus their claim is equally strong. Further, the Jews left Israel essentially relinquishing their stake. The Palestinians then allowed the Jews land to return to, and they (the Jews) became greedy and stole the rest of it (the "how would you feel if you invited someone into your house..." argument). Lastly, the Palestinians were living peacfully in Israel and were then expelled from their homes and thus have a right to return.
Personally: the philistine claim is certainly false, as genetic analysis has shown Palestinians to be semites, and not descendants of Greek sea-people. The "allowing Jews to return" argument is also innaccurate, as the local population sold land (did not invite them) and rioted relatively often against the Jews (also not a great invitation), and any land "stealing" came as a result of defensively fought wars and not aggressive takeovers. I would agree that those expelled from Israel (meaning expelled from Israel, not left of their own volition, meaning definately not all Palestinians and probably not most) could receive some compensation, however this is only if the Arab states that expelled their Jews (all of them) also compensate Israel. Since the numbers are more or less the same, that's essentially a payment from the Arab League to the Palestinians. Further, the huge growth in the Palestinian population is unexplainable through base-stock growth alone. There was clearly a substantial number of immigrants to the British Mandate Palestine who are now considered Palestinians. Lastly, I would in theory agree to a two-state solution, but only if I was sure it would be democratic and peaceful, two conditions that don't seem to be met yet.

EDIT: Ok, to respond to mark: the 'Old Palestinians' you refer to are the Philistines, not the Palestinians. I've already addressed the Philistine argument. You are correct in saying that the area was called Palestine for the last 2000 years or so, but that's just semantics and has no relevance to the people called "Palestinian" today. The land was named after the Philistines, and the people after the land. Also, your 80 year kingdom argument is flawed; the united kingdom existed for 80 years perhaps, but both kingdoms that split from it were Israelite (meaning Jewish in modern speak) and maintained control for hundreds of years.

EDIT: Ok, seems the Philistine point needs to be addressed again. According to the majority of historians, the Philistine invasion of Israel coincided with the Israelite invasion of Israel, meaning the Philistines do not predate the Israelites on Israeli soil. Furthermore, the Philistines never had control of the whole region, just 5 city states along the coast (Gat, Gaza, Ashkelon, Ekron, Ashdod), while the Israelites did conquer the whole area (including the Philistines). All this means is that even if modern Palestinians are descended from the Philistines (which as I said genetic analysis does not support), they would only have a contemporary claim and not a prior claim, and that claim would be to the southern coastal region only.

say3etba7r

Now they are playing
The one who wake up early take the land and kill the other.

jessica b

tuty -you are the worst of any human i have ever met, and i have met my fair share. so you are to say that we horrible jews have no reason to dislike the palestinians. especially when your uncle was burned. forgive me for saying this. when children are left parentless and a mother and son are in the hospital and nearly die because the are bomed while giving charity no matter how little they have. is the fighting right, no, but you cannot sit there and say that it is all the israelis fault. why do the palestinians neglect their living areas. in jerusalem, in the old city much less than east jerusalem, the christian and muslim quarters are filthy. you have no respect for the place you live, why would you respect your fellow human. this is all to teach israelis a lesson. i have friends that are palestinians that are not near as spitful as you are. you views are what makes this world be so full of hate.

MikeInRI

It really all depends on who's interpretation of the past you agree with - the story found in the bible or the story found in that book written by the Arabian salesman on the road to Mecca. Take your pick. If you think Issac was given the rights to Abraham's wealth then you have to say the ancestors of the Israelis. If you say it was Ishmael then you agree to the Palestinians. This is a war between two half brothers that has gone back now for at least 3500 years. As it is said - it is as old as the bible itself.

As a Jew I have always believe it was given to my ancestors and we have the greater right to it. As a rational human being I agreed with the UN's partition plan that Israel agreed to. However, the Palestinians did not and so the struggle continues.

Good Luck!!!

Janice

I am on Israel's side. It is their land and everyone should STOP fighting over it. Since when has land become more valuable then human lives? I do believe that the Palestinians should have a place to call home. I am not quite sure how that will happen, but I have faith that God will work it out.

A ROAR!!!

I am with Israel all the way!!! Because I say so!!!

ROAR!!!

Serious Business

I don't think palestine existed before the sudden mass immigration of jews and the subsequent wars that followed, but that was probably because it didn't need to be. It was already in a state of relative harmony. That harmony will probably never be restored whatever the outcome.

redefourit

I am not religious, but think if there is a GOD he has a sense of humour.

Otherwise why put three major conflicting religions within 50 kilometers of one another? The Bible, Koran and Talmud all speak of wars to cleanse the area of others who do not think and worship the same.

It is not- to me- important who was there first, its why can't these religions live in peace and trust in their God. That shows me the weakness of their argument they worship the one true peaceful DEITY

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