Should Israel give up land for a 'supposed peace' ??

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Lupines supports GEERT WILDERS

That would be appeasement, which reminds me of Ronald Reagan's speech.

"Those who would trade our freedom for the soup kitchen of the welfare state have told us that they have a utopian solution of peace without victory. They call their policy "accommodation." And they say if we only avoid any direct confrontation with the enemy, he will forget his evil ways and learn to love us. All who oppose them are indicted as warmongers. They say we offer simple answers to complex problems. Well, perhaps there is a simple answer--not an easy answer--but simple.

" Alexander Hamilton said, "A nation which can prefer disgrace to danger is prepared for a master, and deserves one." Let's set the record straight. There is no argument over the choice between peace and war, but there is only one guaranteed way you can have peace--and you can have it in the next second--surrender.

Admittedly there is a risk in any course we follow other than this, but every lesson in history tells us that the greater risk lies in appeasement, and this is the specter our well-meaning liberal friends refuse to face--that their policy of accommodation is appeasement, and it gives no choice between peace and war, only between fight and surrender. If we continue to accommodate, continue to back and retreat, eventually we have to face the final demand--the ultimatum. And what then?" -- Ronald Reagan 1964

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tu-YRwDpvM
http://www.reaganlibrary.com/reagan/speeches/rendezvous.asp

I can't see why anyone would want to appease them. They are a political movement set up to overtake Israel, to push Israel into the sea. It's like giving a bully your lunch money when he really wants your bank account.

History shows that palestinians have no claim to the land they got their roots in PLO as a political movement spoon fed by Egypt to overtake Israel by force. The PLO charter even signed off ALL rights to ANY land and expressed they would make an army to do such. Jordan expelled them because they went to overtake Jordan which was their half of the palestine region. Then they were expelled from Lebanon. Egypt abandoned their infant. And now Hamas overthrew more moderate Fatah.

They are even admitting what they are doing:

"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism. For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa. While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan." -- PLO Executive Committee member Zuhayr Muhsin, March 31, 1977, interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw."

If you want stuff from Quran, then hey.. .the immans speak oodles about what their plans are. They don't just want Israel, they want the rest of the world too:

Hamas MP and Cleric Yunis Al-Astal in a Friday Sermon: We Will Conquer Rome, and from There Continue to Conquer the Two Americas and Eastern Europe April 11, 2008. http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/1739.htm

Quote Yunis Al-Astal: "Allah has chosen you for Himself and for His religion, so that you will serve as the engine pulling this nation to the phase of succession, security, and consolidation of power, and even to conquests thorough da'wa and military conquests of the capitals of the entire world. Very soon, Allah willing, Rome will be conquered, just like Constantinople was, as was prophesized by our Prophet Muhammad. Today, Rome is the capital of the Catholics, or the Crusader capital, which has declared its hostility to Islam, and has planted the brothers of apes and pigs in Palestine in order to prevent the reawakening of Islam â€“ this capital of theirs will be an advanced post for the Islamic conquests, which will spread through Europe in its entirety, and then will turn to the two Americas, and even Eastern Europe."

TAREK

Give up land which they took by force? it is not their land to give in the first place!

But i do believe Isreal and its neighobrs NEED PEACE as soon as possible.

Radical Zionists and Radical Islamists are the same to me, they are both responsible for the suffering of the Palestinians and the Israelis.

I'm convinced most Palestinians and Arabs as well as Israelis just want to LIVE and provide for their families, but its the politicians that make things complicated and keep playing games on their societies!

J Q Public

Yes. In the past there were no borders or countries,that is recent creation. Today we are supposed to be more civilized,Israel and Palestine was created by world consensus,that should be the order of things. Back before countries the world was ruled by the sword,today I would hope we have advanced past violence being the deciding factor. Genghis Khan,Alexander,Hannibal,Xerxes,Vlad Dracul,those and many others deserve respect yet they have no place in the modern world.

j j

I'm with you--there is no such thing as land for peace. <sigh>

For the record:
(Globull, you have a great name, you are so full of bull!)
The Israeli Army is the ONLY army on record that does not RAPE. Israelis are continuing to purchase land. The Jews have been repurchasing land for decades. You are so one sided and hateful, you are an example and a representative of those who want to destroy Israel. You peace can only come with no Jews. Sorry to disappoint you cousin. We're not going any where. You lay down your arms and believe me, war will end. Talk to Hamas about what they are doing with the food and water and gas that Israel sends to civilians. Go seek truth.

HopelessZ00

If they want Peace....why not?

Pedestal42

So that's not exactly a neutral question, then...

Both sides have missed opportunities for peace since the illegal founding of Israel, in violence, in 1948.
(Oh sorry, you're not so keen on drastic assertions from the other perspective? But on what grounds would you consider it legal?)
And radical Zionists want every piece of Palestine mentioned as Jewish in their Holy Book*.
Until moderates on either side can sit on their own extemists there can be no peace.

No, it's far too late to do other than find a settlement that includes a two state solution. It might have happened in 1948. Anwar Sadat was killed for attempting to reach one...
Arafat coudn;t face accepting probably the best chance, in 1994.

What are you proposing, exactly? Genocide?
I thought that was tried some 65 years ago, the other way round.

*as though "2000 years ago" gave occupation rights.
If they do, Americans of European descent had better hope Native Americans don't realise it.

edit:
"Ped, Israel wasn't founded illegally but was 1st proposed by the British Balfour Declaration in 1917..
Read your history not Arab propoganda!"

And that is very much only to look at one side of the issue!
(Apart from skating over what happened in 1948).
At the same time as the Balfour declaration, (which said nothing about founding a nation), see also what was being promised to the Arabic people: for example in the McMahon correspondence.
We British, seeming to twice- or thrice- promise the land of Palestine, bear much more reponsibility for the situation than is often realised
"The British later claimed that the Balfour declaration was consistent with the McMahon correspondence and the Sykes-Picot agreement, but the three documents seem to contradict each other."
You bet they do. No wonder we wriggled. And no wonder, having felt betrayed by the British After WW1, the Arabs in general were reluctant to support and trust the British in WW2. Which had the consequences of reducing their influence post-WW2... and so history rolls on.

For a full discussion of the history of Palestine, go to the UN accounts below.
The documents can be linked to from a short overview at the last URL

My viewpoint has arisen simply from swallowing Arabic propaganda? Hardly. I know those URL's below and have worked through them.

PaliSupporter91 Ø§Ù„ÙÙ„Ø³Ø·ÙŠÙ†ÙŠ Ù…Ø¤ÙŠØ¯

Let me ask you a question!
What Qur'an are you reading?!
when the Qur'an talks about The Children of Israel, its not referring to present day Israel! the Qur'an has been the same for over 1400 years! and back then Israel was not a country (Israel was founded in 1948 as you know)
and just to let you to know, in the Quran it tells us to respect the "people of the the book" AKA Christians and Jews.
the present day war is between Zionist (Who happen to be mostly Jews) and Arabs (who happen to be mostly Muslim)!
I'm sorry you didn't know that

peace lover

well it seems like it worked with egypt, but that may be from a bygone era.
israel gave up all of gaza and was met only with more war and hatred.
no more land, no more deals.

XXX

The Europeans couldn't wait to get rid of you and throw you out of their continent, and now we're the bad guys? I guess they realized that you're not worth the trouble.

Sweet P

they shouldnt...that land wasnt "taken" from the palestinians!! it belonged to the british who offered it!! besides before israel was formed there were practically no ppl living there! nobody wanted to live in the desert...but since israel was created many palestinians are claiming land they didnt even want before!!! they werent even forced to leave! the israelis offered them to make them official citizens but they didnt want to because the arabs leader told them to leave so they could push the jews to the sea!!

Globull

Actually the first day they signed, Israel announced it was going to build another 1,200 ILLEGAL settlements on stolen Palestinian land. You can talk all you want about the "chicken of the egg" theory but sticking your head in the sand won't make the truth go away.

You don't have any LEGAL right to burn my house down if I rape members of your family. But I think a lot of people would understand why you did what you did. Especially if I've been raping them since 1948 without consequence.

moneymaxer

Never.

Those idiots who say that Jews outta do it in the name of peace are simply appeasers.

It is in the name of peace that Jews must NEVER give any of their land to anyone. It is in the name of peace that Jews must ALWAYS eradicate their enemy quickly and effectively.

Recent history has shown us that when Jews appease, they only get more war, and less support from the world community.

m i

Why is Israel shooting innocent civilians in Gaza if they supposedly agreed to stop?

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=62160&sectionid=351020202
http://pchrgaza.org/files/W_report/English/2008/26-06-2008.htm

I can tell you why, Israel doesn't actually want peace, it might mean at the very least giving up land taken illegally by war. If you have any factual evidence that the state of Israel wants peace please supply it.

As for whether Hamas wants Israel, in fact the land Israel is on belonged to Palestinians before Israel's Zionist founders committed deliberate and premeditated ethnic cleansing against them and forced them from their homes at gunpoint and under threat of massacre. It should not be too surprising that they want their own land back. Israel is the only country that came into being since WWII founded on the premise of ethnic cleansing.

No no war mongers

Isreal ought to make peace with their neighbors. Why can't they get along and stop fighting with everyone. They have been fighting constantly for years and years and everyone else in the world should be sick of it. They are putting the ENTIRE world in jepordy be/c they can't learn to get along with others and are constantly fighting.
People like you are going to be why the world is going to end ... stop ruining it for everyone else!

Felix C

The only answer I see is to let the Arabs have their state so Israel can officially and legally declare war on them and end the problem.
There has been so many years of warning so the people can find a way to peaceful relations yet they refuse to do so involving women and children in their hate.
Two Nations could either make peace and establish trade or sanctions against each other.
It just isn't working the way it is.

lemon_lorrain

Land should be given ONLY AS PART OF A DEAL FOR ISRAEL ACCESSION TO THE E.U. In THAT way, Israel will have SECURE AND RECOGNIZED BORDERS!

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